New York Times Errs In Reporting Protest
by Big Dog on Sep 13, 2009 at 17:12 Political
There was a huge protest in DC with an estimated 1.3 to 2 million** people descending on the Capitol to protest out of control government and its out of control spending. The protests were about the health care overhaul as well as the stimulus, the cap and trade and all the other items that have led to a deficit of 1.3 TRILLION dollars. People have awakened to how out of control government is, a condition that is not specific to any one party. Government has been out of control for years and Republicans have been as bad as Democrats when it comes to fiscal responsibility.
We now have the party of big government and the party of bigger government from which to choose.
The New York Times though, saw it differently. They reported that the protest was against Obama. This is how most liberals (except those who were at the protest) see any condemnation of government. It, to them, is against Obama.
As President Barack Obama flew to Minnesota on Saturday to rally support for his health care plan, a sea of protesters filled the west lawn of the Capitol and spilled onto the National Mall on Saturday in the largest rally against Obama since he took office, a culmination of a summer-long season of protests that began with opposition to the health care overhaul and grew into a broader dissatisfaction with government. Statesman.com (reprint of NYT story) [emphasis mine]
The protest was not against Obama and was not a conservative only event though I am sure his ego leads him to believe this. Certainly the partisan NYT holds this view as does the Washington Post which reported that:
Tens of thousands of conservative protesters, many complaining that the nation is racing toward socialism, massed outside the U.S. Capitol on Saturday, angrily denouncing President Obama’s health-care plan and other initiatives as threats to the Constitution.
The protest no doubt consisted mostly of conservatives but there were many liberals and moderates as well. The common thinking in the ivory towers of the media is that no logical person would oppose this government (and in their view, Obama) so it must be the conservatives who are protesting.
Lost in all of this are the Democrats in Congress who oppose the legislation. They have the numbers to get done what they want but are unable because their own oppose the legislation. This is because their constituents, people of all political beliefs, let them have an earful during the August recess.
The media wing of the Democratic party would have America believe that the only people opposed to the government’s actions are conservatives and that the protests are against Obama. Both of these statements are incorrect and show a lack of journalistic integrity.
Americans of all political stripes are concerned about the out of control spending of the government and of the way that item after item is rushed through with little debate and with no one reading what the bills contain. People are also tired of being lied to.
Americans do not want the bills for the government’s inability to exercise fiscal restraint passed on to their children and grandchildren.
People have had enough and are demonstrating to show politicians their distrust and dissatisfaction.
They have that right under our Constitution in the same Amendment that allows freedom of the press.
It is too bad that the press lacks the integrity of the people who protest.
**This number is from earlier reports that were attributed to ABC News. ABC is saying it never made those estimates. The numbers now reported are from 75,000 to healthy 6 figures depending upon who you ask. The issue in the post is how the news attributed this to a protest against Obama by conservatives, which is a lie. But since someone was kind enough to point out the number issue I wanted to make it clear.
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Tags: deficit, lies, Obama, protest, spending, washington dc
The liars in the mainstream media can’t stop the truth of the American people. They know when they very lives are being threatened. No amount of spin, obfuscation or fabrication from the left will stop us. They are finished. We don’t need them anymore, we won’t buy their horse manure anymore.
Bigd: There was a huge protest in DC with an estimated 1.3 to 2 million people descending on the Capitol>>
DAR
This is an astonishing howler. A profoundly, objectively false statement.
See a picture of what a group of a million people looks like at this location. Then look at the picture of this little group of 30-60 thousand.
How I missed the 2 million man teabagging flash mob today.
Let’s be charitable and say it was 45k.
And let’s round your claim off to 1.6 million.
Divide 1.6m by 45k and we see that you are off by 35x.
Close!
And make sure and see
all the stoopid peepul who can’t spell words on their signs right.
Wish I could have been there.
D.
—————–
“Shuster: “Freedomworks says their DC demonstration attracted 30,000 people. Park police official says that is being ‘generous.'”
http://mediamatters.org/blog/200909120013
LOL!
There were more than 60,000 people there- take my word for it- Estimating the volume of things is a specialty of mine, and the volume of people was 60,000 ( on the conservative side- I err because I am not counting small children- they gum up my estimate- they’re small.
If you’d been there, they probably would have beaten you to a pulp- but on the bright side, you would have been graciously deposited in a trash receptacle, or set to one side with the rest of the rubbish.
Conservatives pick up after themselves, not like spoiled rotten libtards, who expect the “masses” to pick up their “elite” trash.
BLK: “If you’d been there, they probably would have beaten you to a pulp…”>>
DAR
When you don’t have the truth on your side or a leg to stand on, turn to violence.
They would like me. I could fit right in. Just paint something obnoxious and false on a sign, spell basic words wrong and hold it upside down. I would fit right in, they would welcome me as one of their own.
D.
————-
New Rule: The Obama Birthers, the 9/11 Truthers, and the moon landing deniers must merge their theories so we can have all the batsh-t in the same place. And then we’ll take away the Internet so that you can communicate your theories the old fashioned way: by sitting on a park bench yelling at a pigeon.” –Bill Maher
You need to lump in those deluded souls who actually believe Nobumma- there’s you some whackjobs.
I wondered if you’d report that a million people showed up like some other conservatives had. That is the most laughable thing I’ve heard in a while. Where’s the pictures of a crowd that big? Why is it we’re only seeing pictures of people with signs and the only crowd shots are during the main event when the thousands of people, not millions, gathered together.
Obama’s inauguration didn’t even pull much more than 1 million, even fewer by some estimates. You want us to believe as many, if not twice as many people showed up on 9/12 as on 1/20? Get real. There was respectable turnout but pushing bogus estimates just voids that.
It’s time for teabaggers to face reality: More people attend Washington Redskins games on average each year than people estimate attended the 9/12 rally. Go Redskins? I’d rather root for the Cowboys but the figure is what it is.
You asinine libtards jst can’t resist the tea- bagging insults, can you?
That’s a pity, since you are the party that wants to have sex with animals (Peter Singer and Cass Sunstein), and especially since you are supposed to be tolerant, when you are anything but- In truth, like in times past, when it was the Democrats holding the doors of the universities closed to Blacks, and setting dogs on those who dared to sit at lunch counters and ride buses- Well, the more things change, the more they stay the same, it seems.
What a bunch of dirtbags, and hypocrites you are.
I can’t wait til hunting you is legal.
BLK: “Democrats holding the doors of the universities closed to Blacks, and setting dogs”>>
DAR
Those were Dixiecrat conservatives. Your people! The ones Nixon took back with his “southern strategy.” The ones in your little rally that are still pissed that liberals made them stop doing those things.
Next on the check list, fully equality for gays.
D.
————–
Quick history lesson:
“Liberal policies made America the freest, wealthiest, most successful and most powerful nation in human history. Conservatism in power always threatens to undo that national progress, and is almost always frustrated by the innate decency and democratic instincts of the American people…
If your workplace is safe; if your children go to school rather than being forced into labor; if you are paid a living wage, including overtime; if you enjoy a 40-hour week and you are allowed to join a union to protect your rights — you can thank liberals. If your food is not poisoned and your water is drinkable — you can thank liberals. If your parents are eligible for Medicare and Social Security, so they can grow old in dignity without bankrupting your family — you can thank liberals. If our rivers are getting cleaner and our air isn’t black with pollution; if our wilderness is protected and our countryside is still green — you can thank liberals. If people of all races can share the same public facilities; if everyone has the right to vote; if couples fall in love and marry regardless of race; if we have finally begun to transcend a segregated society — you can thank liberals. Progressive innovations like those and so many others were achieved by long, difficult struggles against entrenched power. What defined conservatism, and conservatives, was their opposition to every one of those advances.
The country we know and love today was built by those victories for liberalism — with the support of the American people.”
— Joe Conason
Mindless prattle.
I don’t believe there are any people left out there that still don’t know what “tea-bagging” refers to….
So henceforth, when I see the term, I immediately discount this person as an ugly, mean-spirited troll.
Thusly, nothing that they say has any influence on my viewpoint. Intolerant pricks…
DAR
Not “each year,” each game!
Well, I reported what was twittered that was reported from ABC. Then the parks service had the 1.2 number. This website has a shot of the people from one end to the other of the mall. If you look at the picture I think you will see the big crowd you are asking about.
Is it a million people? I don’t know I was not there. I was using the numbers that were attributed to ABC news.
But I shall put a disclaimer..
I followed the first link at your own link and found:
***
ABC News Was Misquoted on Crowd Size
ABC News Reported D.C. Rally Size in Tens of Thousands, Not 1M to 1.5M as Activist Said.
LINK.
I have wondered where Darrell and Adam got their horrible personalities. Now I know since I see they associate with Bill Maher. I didn’t think anyone could stoop as low as Bill is.
I like how Darrell quotes Maher and now I’m an associate of him as well. Liberals aren’t Borg, Barbara. Darrell and I are two different people even if we both tend to agree you folks are idiots.
Borg? OMG- you’re a trekkie! I used to work with one- now I know why you are the way you are.
And if you are free to spew this mindless prattle thank the conservatives who fight for the country while the liberals wet their pants and protest.
Bingo!!
Remember all the hippies screaming, “Hell no, We won’t Go!”
It’s the right to free expression, stupid….
Speaking of mindless prattle, we have Blake freaking out because I called a tea-bagger a tea-bagger. Look, liberals didn’t make up the term to demean these rubes, they said it themselves first and we just like to continue that.
Then Blake goes to equating animal rights proponents to people wanting to have sex with animals. Why is there always beastiality in the slippery slope with you conservatives? That’s what I wonder. Conservatives fantasize about some crazy stuff…
Adam- hose people have said that they feel that that would be fine- apparently they feel that if gay people can get married, then it is but a small step to eternal bliss with Fifi.
That is basically what Singer and Sunstein propose.
And conservatives didn’t use the tea-bagging phrase, that came from you all.
I did find Peter Singer’s quote about sex with animals. I’m still unclear why you equate Singer and Sunstein in such a way as if Sunstein believes it because Singer said it. Maybe you should source that connection for me since you failed to in the past. I’m still not even sure why Singer keeps coming up other than to smear Sunstein. Furthermore you are taking the opinion of one man and making it the view of an group of people who don’t even know the guy. Get real, that’s more of your classic garbage.
As far as liberals making up the tea-bag phrase, keep dreaming. If you watch the Maddow clip that’s around where she mocks the use you’ll see her citing several examples coming from Fox and from various conservative sources.
And I am supposed to believe that feminazi Maddow? Get real- you use the slur, andyour mindless ilk created it- go on, at least be a man and own it, rather than try and pass it off as someone else’s.
I understand why you are ashamed of your side’s smears, but you need to man up here and just admit it.
Otherwise, you are just someone’s flack, mindlessly repeating the pap you hear.
Why don’t you “man up” and show me the connection between Singer and Sunstein and how the opinion of one man is the opinion of millions of people. Let me go out and find the most outrageous conservative garbage and then come and blame you for that as if all of you believe it because you’re conservatives. It wouldn’t be very adult of me, would it? So why don’t you stop calling for me to man up and spend a little more time yourself on growing up?
Singer and Sunstein have been close friends for awhile now, and birds of a feather do tend to stay close and share ideals (and animals, possibly)- Sunstein strikes me as being “open to that behavior” with his attitudes about animal “rights”.
Freaking out? Hardly, since it is SO expected from you progressives- everytime you run out of intelligent discourse, you revert to insults, like teabagger, or the classic-“Racist”- you throw that one around a lot, or it’s close cousin, “bigot”. Very intelligent and classy. The moment you say those things you lose the debate.
To lose a debate with you there would have to be a debate. For you debate is “Why do I need facts and evidence to back up what I say? It’s just an opinion.” Also my favorite, “You can neither prove nor disprove what I’m saying so I have every right to say it.”
It is called an “opinion”- get familiar with the term.
And if you cannot disprove it, it must be a good one.
http://michellemalkin.com/
There is a bunch of “fake,” photos over at Michelle Malkin for you libbys.
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2009/09/912_demonstration_a_record_dc.html
September 13, 2009
9/12 demonstration a record DC turnout: National Park Service
Thomas Lifson
The truth will out. Despite mainstream media attempts to characterize turnout as in the thousands, a spokesman for the National Park Service, Dan Bana, is quoted as saying “It is a record…. We believe it is the largest event held in Washington, D.C., ever.”—-
Largest event…ever? EVER? Victoria’s taken on the role of serial exaggerator and she’s too blind to notice her source is so obviously in error.
A quick check on the quote is all it takes.
Is it Dan Bana? Or is it David Barna? Shades of the Incredible Hulk, but I digress.
The point is your quote is totally bogus. The person “Dan Bana” doesn’t exist. You just gave us a quote from David Barna, a real spokesman for the National Park Service, and he was talking about the Obama inauguration.
Yes, the truth will out indeed. The American Thinker blog needs to do a little more American Thinking and a lot less American Fabricating. You’d be wise to not quote them in the future, Victoria.
Boy- you would be wise not to reference trekkies OR the Incredible hulk in ANYTHING you write- this is what leads people to believe you are a sad slacker living in your mama’s basement- a total disconnect from reality.
Come on, where’s the elves or hobbit references from those other movies?
Dungeons and Dragons, anyone?
I’m sorry that you’re such a sad old man (Oh! Ageism!) that you can’t laugh at a joke about the Incredible Hulk. I don’t think you want to see my mother’s basement or you wouldn’t picture me living there. I wouldn’t even make Darth Cheney (Oh! Star Wars reference! Look out!) live there.
ok- now I’m waiting for a Dora the explorer reference. Could she navigate in your mom’s basement?
As for the photos and videos, it looks like photos and videos of tens of thousands of people to me, just like the media is reporting. We never said there were 10 folks there. Thirty to a hundred thousand people is a lot of people. But two million people? Now that would be something…
I didn’t say anything– the article in the “American Thinker said it,” If you bothered reading it. And here is another one for you.
You just can’t stand it can you and you think if you prove I said Dan or David or whatever makes a difference.
http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2009/09/912-attendance-metrics-1-million-plus.html
This talk about the American Thinker made my wife make a joke from the Will Ferrell’s homeless nude model skit on SNL about whether the art class wanted the Thinker…or the Stinker.
I see now they are working to fix the quote on the blog but it’s already been spread around the internet by people like Victoria. Once again the truth has a liberal bias…
Oh, right. I’m loving Victoria’s old “I didn’t lie, I just quoted a source that lied” excuse. That works every time.
There weren’t a million people marching on DC this weekend, get over it. There were not millions, not even hundreds of thousands. There were tens of thousands.
We’ll see- but since the media are on their knees doing Nobama, we might have to rely on estimates, so the argument continues- I personally estimate from crowd density, approx. 60- 85,000 people- not a bad turnout.
Not a bad turnout at all. Totally respectable and bigger than most events ever there probably. Just not 2 million, and not the ‘biggest, ever.’
I am not ready to say what the final numbers are, but I will say, conservatives are certainly better at picking up after ourselves than the libtards that attended Nobummer’s coronation.
Now they were TRASHY people.
You’ve got a couple of photos for evidence and it’s funny either way. There’s a reason there’s not as much garbage left behind by 50,0000 people compared to 1,000,000 people.
Actually, the numbers are firming up and it was 75,000- 80,000 people, so the trash thing is pretty much out the window.
Face it- we are just neater people.
We are your parents.
My parents aren’t morons so they didn’t go to DC to protest the black man in the white house under the guise of opposing government spending they were fine with when an elephant was signing the checks.
My bad…80,000 is just so much closer to 1,000,000 than 50,000. I was so wrong…
There he goes with the racist stuff again- a knee jerk reaction with no basis in reality, but when has reality ever stopped a liberal, or “progressive”, or hell, lets call a spade a spade- Socialist from slinging slurs.
Short on logic, nonexistent on common sense, has to resort to insults.
Pity.
There has been some analysis done and people are saying 300-400 thousand. There were far more than 60,000.
I reported what was reported from ABC on a tweet. Did ABC report it and retract like they did with the Obama called Kanye a jackass tweet?
Don’t know. I reported what I got in a tweet. There was no indication that it was an error at the time I reported it.
One of the UK papers quoted the number as well.
I think the time photography shows that there were far more than 50k. Funny how the left is working so hard to downplay a huge number of people.
I had a friend there who guessed it was around 300k based on what they filled up.
They were thinkc from the Capitol halfway to the monument.
And Adam, I have been at the DC protests where 20k lefties left one hell of a mess and 30k of us left it clean. Those numbers compare. You people are pigs. And should it matter how many there are? Green world and all that.
What can I say? Bunch of dirty _____ing hippies…
Yes- Yes, you are.
The funny thing in all of this is that Darrel and Adam are so infatuated with their liberal ideals that they have to continually attack the number of people who attended the rally when the point of the post was that the NYT and WAPO lied about the purpose and who was involved. I don’t see where they agreed that these two organizations lied.
I think it is funny that the park service will not dispute the 1.8 million number, the Guardian UK said over a million, ABC was reported to have said it (before they didn’t) and there are a few density studies as well as overlays of the inauguration that show numbers at least in the mid to high 6 figures and people are sticking with 60-70k.
The other oddity is that this is not what the post was about. It was about the lies the NYT and the WAPO told.
Not one of the libs addressed this issue.
You mean the “issue” that the event really wasn’t an anti-Obama rally put together and attended by conservatives?
Really?
Who could believe that?
I guess staying on topic is more of an issue when the direction of the conversation makes conservatives look like fools. There weren’t even 1 million people in DC this weekend if you add the protesters to the number of people who live there.
Nice unpacking of the whole number thing here:
***
Tea for Two… Million?
FreedomWorks, Twitter, and the evolution of an error
Columbia Journalism Review.
D.
————-
“Even Glenn Beck, who fashioned himself, from his perch in New York City, the day’s master of ceremonies via his 9/12 Project, grudgingly accepted those numbers: “The official estimate is 60,000 people,” he said during his live coverage of the protest. “I’ve lived in Washington. It looks more than 60,000. But we’ll go with the official numbers today.”
Funny, Beck did not make that admission on his show today.
And this is what came in an email from Beck:
Wow, what an amazing turn out in Washington DC over the weekend. Hundreds of thousands of regular schlubs like you took time out of their busy lives to head down to Washington and let it be known that they are not happy with the out of control government. Obama’s senior adviser, David Axelrod, didn’t seem to get the message — saying he didn’t think this represented what America thinks and flatly said ‘they are wrong.’ Imagine if a crowd like THIS showed up to protest Bush. What do you think David Axelrod would have said then? [emphasis mine]
BECK: “Imagine if a crowd like THIS showed up to protest Bush. What do you think David Axelrod would have said then?”
DAR
That’s easy. He would have said they were right. And with good reason.
Far bigger crowds showed up, here and around the world, to protest Bush.
D.
—————–
“Europe saw the biggest mobilization of protesters, including a rally of 3 million people in Rome, which is listed in the Guinness Book of Records as the largest ever anti-war rally.[2]
According to the French academic Dominique Reynié, between January 3 and April 12, 2003, 36 million people across the globe took part in almost 3,000 protests against the Iraq war.”[3]
wiki.
So Adam, the people who protested government were morons? You resort to the racist rant that it was about the black man in the WH. That is untrue but go ahead with your fantasy.
The truth is that at the core of this movement is the Ron Paul revolution and his crazy train of scared white people filling out the ranks of the birthers, 10thers, truthers, racists, new world order conspiracy theorists, and gun nuts. Mix in the average people who for some reason trust Glenn Beck and Fox News to deliver the truth to them and you have quite a movement…
See the liberal who runs out of logic, and reverts yet again to smears, and slurs and outright insults- par for the course in a world where he wouldn’t have the stones to say that to my face.
At least more than once…
I don’t see where I ran out of logic. It’s not a smear to look at a crowd of people and say there are birthers, 10thers, truthers, racists, new world order conspiracy theorists, and gun nuts mixed in with average people who get their facts from Fox News. Just look at the photos. I would say that to your face no matter how many “stones” you think I have. Not sure what you think you’d do to me for saying it…
I have not the most patience in the world for obnoxious, ill- mannered little snots who think they are tough, and curse people on the internet- to my face, you say those things, and it would be the last time you would be so rash.
If you have no argument do something intelligent and shut up.
Not sure what you’re freaking out but if it makes you feel like a big man to imagine physical violence against me for speaking truth to you then I guess we know what kind of person you are…
Your “truth” is subjective, and real truth is not ever subjective- it is just the truth, plain and simple.
And you have scant experience with the truth, so you should probably just hush up.
You pretend to be what you are not- an honest debater- that is your lack, and you really should try to do something about that.
Bigd: “The protest no doubt consisted mostly of conservatives but there were many liberals and moderates as well.”>>
DAR
Well, by Bigdog math, close. There was one! And look how they treated him. Where would anyone possibly get the idea that this was an anti-Obama event, by conservatives, and not open to dissent from that position?
See the video. I see at least six security guards which grew to over twenty. They did what they could.
The Liberal.
D.
Well, the more that people look at the various photos, the more the number goes up- now, the consensus is approx. 400,000- 600,000 people, based on crowd density numbers taken in relation to pix of Nobummer’s inaugural event.
So by Darrel math because there was one liberal protesting against the protesters, there were no liberals protesting with them. That is loony even for you.
No, I didn’t say that. But your claim that the crowd was “mostly conservatives” and that there were “many liberals and moderates as well” is of course ridiculous.
As this video shows, the fact that one liberal shows up with his sign and needs dozens of security for protection from the seething chanting mob that circles him and singles him out, certainly refutes this fantasy that this protest was anything other than entirely your folks, and that they were also intolerant of any dissent from that opinion.
D.
Not all liberals showed up to “protest” the protest- some were in the crowd because they thought the cause is just, and Nobama scares them with his communistic views.
So, and anti war rally equates to an anti Bush rally? You can do better than that.
Bigd; “So, and anti war rally equates to an anti Bush rally?”>>
DAR
I thought that was obvious.
Darrel, you are obviously wrong. One person shows up and starts trouble and has police surround her. That does not mean that there were no liberals there. It does not mean that ONLY conservatives were there.
But you believe what you want.