Seizing Our Pensions Will Cause Civil Unrest
by Big Dog on Oct 19, 2010 at 23:14 Political
If you want to see all 435 members of the House and the 100 members of the Senate impaled on pike poles as their bodies slide down in agony until their torture ends in death ala Vlad The Impaler or if you want to see these same 535 members of Congress hanging from light posts around DC while birds peck at their lifeless bodies then let them go ahead with their plan to seize private pension plans to pay off the union and public pensions.
Yes, our government is considering confiscating the money we have in our 401(k) plans and the redistributing it in a more fair manner. On top of that they will impose a 5% payroll tax on everyone and that will go into the retirement fund to pay everyone a retirement. This would be on top of the Social Security we already pay for.
In a nutshell, under the GRA system government would seize private 401(k) accounts, setting up an additional 5% mandatory payroll tax to dole out a “fair” pension to everyone using that confiscated money coupled with the mandated contributions. This would, of course, be a sister government ponzi scheme working in tandem with Social Security, the primary purpose being to give big government politicians additional taxpayer funds to raid to pay for their out-of-control spending. Human Events
If these people have a death wish for this country then they should press ahead with their plans to take money that we saved and decide who gets it and how much. Then they should press on and force higher income workers to pay much more into a system that will never pay back what they put in.
This will lead to massive civil unrest and there will be nothing standing between Congress and the people with the pitchforks.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. — Such has been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world. US Declaration of Independence [emphasis mine]
If this happens and Americans do not end it quickly then we will deserve what we get.
The Congress needs to know we will not waste time with the courts and that we will not negotiate. If they steal OUR money, the money we have worked hard and saved FOR OUR OWN RETIREMENTS, then we need to replace them as our Founders did.
And if that is to harsh for them then they need to reconsider.
Because we are done playing games.
…that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same…
Congress will become a domestic enemy if they steal our money.
Cave Canem!
Never surrender, never submit.
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Tags: civil unrest, confiscation, Congress, Declaration of Independence, enemy, pensions, revolution, seize, theft
Congress will become a domestic enemy if they steal our money.
Congress has been a domestic enemy for quite some time, BD.
“”We must not let our rulers load us with perpetual debt. We must make our selection between economy and liberty or profusion and servitude. If we run into such debts as that we must be taxed in our meat in our drink, in our necessities and comforts, in our labors and in our amusements, for our callings and our creeds…our people.. must come to labor sixteen hours in the twenty-four, give earnings of fifteen of these to the government for their debts and daily expenses; and the sixteenth being insufficient to afford us bread, we must live.. We have not time to think, no means of calling the mis-managers to account, but be glad to obtain subsistence by hiring ourselves to rivet their chains on the necks of our fellow suffers. Our landholders, too…retaining indeed the title and stewardship of estates called theirs, but held really in trust for the treasury, must…be contented with penury, obscurity and exile.. private fortunes are destroyed by public as well as by private extravagance.
This is the tendency of all human governments. A departure from principle becomes a precedent for a second; that second for a third; and so on, till the bulk of society is reduced to mere automatons of misery, to have no sensibilities left but for sinning and suffering… And the fore horse of this frightful team is public debt. Taxation follows that, and in it’s train wretchedness and oppression.” — Thomas Jefferson
well said….I have been calling for revolution for quite some time….they will try to steal the 401k accounts….the only cure for what ails is now is bloodletting.
I have only a little in a 401k, and I’m rapidly approaching retirement age… you know, after 40+ years in the therapy field I’m TIRED, and soon to be RETIRED.
Listen congress, keep your mitts out of my damn pocket. Or suffer the consequences.
To quote Senator Harkin on this:
Yes, Harkin plans to hear several ideas on the subject in several different hearings over the next year. But after the first hearing your side reacts as if folks presenting ideas or information equates to there being a Democratic plan to rob 401ks.
There are light years between considering proposals and planning to implement such proposals but we know it’s more fun to run around outraged and charged up, threatening violence and blood shed.
This is up there with the outrage about how the EPA was “planning” to ban lead bullets because it was going to look at a proposal about it. Of course the proposal was instantly rejected because all sides knew it was a non-starter. But that didn’t stop some conservatives from claiming they actually won and forced the EPA not to do it which is a laugher.
As an aside, I love that you smear the New York Times and label it as having a liberal bias. Then you go around reading and citing conservative rags like WND and Human Events each week. I guess it’s just less about getting to the truth and more about only reading and citing sources that support our world views.
This has been discussed more than once so they held more than one meeting on it and the article says that it is being discussed for implementation in the lame duck session (because this will never happen after that) To downplay this when the person who designed it testified before Congress about a year ago and the issue keeps coming up is blindness on your part.
There are no light years between the election and the next Congress.
There are plenty of outlets you might find more reputable who have reported on this. I think you might find it in the Congressional Record.
Is that good enough for you?
They have a money problem and this is a way they can handle it. The testimony from last year is one reason I changed my contributions and reorganized some of my assets. However, I and many others stand to lose quite a bit of money and we will not stand for it.
The EPA planned to ban lead bullets. The uproar made them change course and claim they were just studying the matter.
There is no threat of violence and bloodshed. This is a promise. If they TAKE our money we will not let it stand.
Take it as you will but whatever you do, don’t get in the way.
“…the article says that it is being discussed for implementation in the lame duck session…”
The article itself is discussing that possibility, not Democrats. Don’t confuse the difference.
“There are plenty of outlets you might find more reputable who have reported on this.”
I’d be happy to see you cite some then. I doubt they’ll say that the Democrats plan to rob 401ks in a lame duck session.
“To downplay this when the person who designed it testified before Congress about a year ago and the issue keeps coming up is blindness on your part.”
The person who testified could have testified every day for the last 10 years and that doesn’t change the reality of what the hearing was and was not. There is no plan to rob 401k accounts. People testify all the time and it does not equal a plan to go forward with the ideas in the testimony.
“The EPA planned to ban lead bullets. The uproar made them change course and claim they were just studying the matter.”
Clearly you swallowed all the gun nut BS on this as well…hook, line and sinker. I’d love to see evidence the EPA was serious about it and not simply reviewing the petition as part of the normal petitioning process.
As for the EPA, it is up to you to prove it was not (thanks to Axelrod).
The Dems said they found her testimony intriguing and that they would like to investigate it further. On Levin’s show she said her goal would be to nationalize the 401(k)s. In case you are unfamiliar, nationalize means take over by government.
Here is the interview
“As for the EPA, it is up to you to prove it was not (thanks to Axelrod).”
I have no idea what Axelrod said but we both know how the logic works here and it’s on you to prove what you’re suggesting.
“The Dems said they found her testimony intriguing…”
Levin said they found it intriguing. You could bring me 200 Democrats that said they supported the plan but that does not equate to a plan to do what they support. It’s not the same and you know it.
Human Events has taken a hearing on the subject and accused Democrats of planning to implement the ideas from the hearing in a lame duck session. You’ve cited a pack of liars.
Yes, that pack of liars that is working to fix union pensions in the lame duck by redistributing pensions and soaking taxpayers.
Axelrod and the regime accused the Chamber and Rove of funneling overseas money to American politics to support Republicans. They have all said it and they are all using it. They have all been clear in the accusation. No proof exists that this is taking place but they keep saying it.
When asked about proof that it was going on Axelrod saod do they (the people accused of wrongdoing) have proof it is not?
This is the new standard so the EPA has to prove it was not.
You guys set the standard. if you allow them to keep making the claims and to say such things you have to live by it as well.
We shall see. But it is like everything else. They wante single payer health care so they worked ways to force it. They want to nationalize retirement plans so they will work the confiscation in. That is the plan.
And we will resist.
“This is the new standard so the EPA has to prove it was not.”
I don’t care what kind of cranky partisan logic Axelrod is employing but we both know that in the real world if you say something and you can’t back it up with proof you typically do one of three things: you either withdraw your statement, spin your way out of it and deflect, or you run and hide from it completely. Which method are you using here with the EPA?
“They want to nationalize retirement plans so they will work the confiscation in. That is the plan.”
Unlike health care which the Democrats had been campaigning on doing for decades, a small number of unnamed, uncounted and unspecified supporters for a nationalized retirement plan does not equal a plan magically. The Democrats are not planning to rob any 401k in a lame duck session. Human Events lied and you’re helping spread that.
The very fact that members of Congress find it interesting and are considering it is the problem. How could they even consider such a thing?
The EPA intended to ban lead bullets. They opened it for public comments and the NRA got involved. It did not come to pass because they do not have the authority. They know it and so do you.
“The very fact that members of Congress find it interesting…”
Which members?
“They opened it for public comments and the NRA got involved.”
It was never open for public comments as far as I can tell. The process is that a petition is filed and has to be responded to within 90 days. The EPA can accept the proposal and start the next steps or reject the proposal with the reason being entered into the federal register. The timeline and process is well documented on their website.
Notice that comments on lead sinker portion of the docket were opened to the public after the denial of the lead bullets portion of the petition and not before.
It’s an assumption without evidence that the EPA was going to accept the petition and open it to the public for comment until the NRA got involved.
Actually I’m wrong in what I just wrote. You are correct that public comment on the the petition was opened to public comment when the petition was submitted to the EPA.
There is still no evidence that the EPA was going to ban lead bullets and was forced to change it’s mind. That is still just an assumption.
Sadly, I don’t think even this would bring people to do, well, anything. No, really.
If Congress passed a law tomorrow and suddenly claimed ownership of all 401Ks, I think the people as a whole would say, “Oh, now we’re REALLY going to vote you out next election!”
And that’s it. I don’t know that there’s enough men left in America to have another revolution, much less a violent one.
What about women?
What about them?
Women can be involved in revolutions too.
It will be us old folks — those of us who remember freedom and have lived long enough — who’ll lock, load, and march. I’ve already had more than enough. All I need is this 401k proposal coming anywhere near to true, and I’ll take on Washington and all its myrmidons by myself.
See you on the front lines.
I truly hope you’re right, Francis. But I know what I see, and I know that one reason freedom is so well-destroyed in this country is the coordination of the socialists — they won’t give you a target.
How about if the 401K seizure comes from a “rule change” by the fed? Congressmen will say, “Oh gee, we didn’t pass any law.” The fed will say, “We’re just following policy.” The bank who takes your money will say, “We have to do what the government tells us.” The police who show up at your door to seize your property will say, “We’re just following orders and doing our job.”
In that area, socialists are smart — if they present a target, they know that will be bad for them. As long as everyone is just “following orders” of someone else, you can’t effectively fight them.
The EPA opened it for public comment. From what I have read, the NRA (its legislative deptm I think) commented about the lack of authority for the EPA (ammo is excluded).
Then the EPA sent notice it was dismissing the ammo part.
They want to regulate the gas we exhale. Lead bullets is not a stretch…
It’s just amazing to me how the right has distorted this. Do a google search for “epa lead bullets” and you’ll find dozens or maybe hundreds of conservative sites spreading the idea that “EPA is trying to ban lead bullets.” It’s was a total lie. The EPA considered the subject because they were petitioned to do so and not because the EPA wanted to ban lead bullets.
At least you have admitted you are stretching to say the NRA is responsible for the EPA denying the petition even if you don’t think it was much of a stretch.
I sadly agree with Ogre.
Look at what this administration has done to America over the past two years. People should have risen up by now!
What has the Obama administration done that merits uprising?
Seized the banking industry, compelling banks to take money even if they did not want it- seizing auto companies, throwing the stock holders BEHIND union goons in the rank of who gets what- that is confiscatory tactics AND it is unconstitutional- now they still own 60% of gubbmint motors.
Using regulations to go around Congress, instead of having Congress pass the laws they are supposed to- and in general doing everything they can to bypass and make irrelevant the other two branches of our government.
In other words, subvert the Constitution.
Is THAT plain enough for you?
But again, I really do hope I’m wrong.
However, that’s one reason I’ve chosen to live free. I’m going to live free, I’m not going to harm anyone else or endanger anyone else. If the government decides I need to be caged, they will cage me. Fighting them, at this point, can only result in my death, simply because I’m too outnumbered by people with guns who will follow orders to kill me.