24/7 Taxes
by Blake on Aug 9, 2009 at 09:52 Political
Nowadays, every liberal is busy thinking of the most creative and intrusive ways to raise taxes- whether it’s on the “95%” that the Resident fervently lied about, claiming, (with fingers crossed, I am sure) there would be no tax increase for the middle class, to the rich- who, while admittedly being able to “afford” the hit, shouldn’t bear an inordinate burden, no matter if the libbies don’t like the rich. Or perhaps they are just guilty for being rich- who knows how they think?
I even think, like some after- school extra credit project gone awry, the Resident tasked his minions to come up with the most devious and Constitutional rights- breaking laws possible. I wonder what the prize is, because we might just have a wiener – I mean winner here.
An Oregon congressman says he wants to test having a government GPS unit in every car so a tax could be imposed on the miles driven.
The proposal, H.R. 3311, which calls for a test project costing $150 million-plus, was introduced by Rep. Earl Blumenauer, D-Ore.
“Oregon has successfully tested a Vehicle Miles Traveled fee, and it is time to expand and test the VMT program across the country,” he said in a statement on his website. “A VMT system can better assess fees based on use of our roads and bridges, as well as during times of peak congestion, than a fee based on use of our roads and bridges, as well as during times of peak congestion, than a fee based on fuel consumption .
His plan calls for the Department of the Treasury to study the idea with test GPS-equipped car projects in every state.
Blumenauer said the Oregon test “charged drivers for the number of miles they traveled rather the fuel they consumed. The test was convenient for drivers, protected personal privacy, and proved to be easily administrable.”
In a WND column, however, Henry Lamb raised several concerns unaddressed by the congressman.
For example, what other applications would there be for a GPS unit attached to each car in the nation?
wnd.com
That’s a great question- what else could they do with this power they want to give themselves, besides taxes, which would be onerous enough. Could they “snoop” on your whereabouts if they so desired? I think they might. Is this a potential power we want to give to anyone? I don’t think so. Also, does anyone think this would replace the gasoline tax, or just be in addition to it?
What about “shutting down the vehicle when its allotted emissions cap had been reached?”
“Why not?” Lamb wrote, “The current cap-and-trade bill would limit industrial emissions and force each business to pay an extra tax for the privilege of emitting additional carbon dioxide. Why not arbitrarily assign a weekly or monthly cap on auto emissions and shut down the vehicle when that limit is reached? The new Global Positioning Satellite device would have that capability.
“Every American ought to be outraged that such a system is even contemplated,” he continued. “This system is the tool that makes slaves of every person who depends upon a vehicle. Every person should consider just how his life would be changed if he were required to get approval from the federal government to start his car.”
Lamb said shutting down a vehicle would be among the less intrusive possibilities.
wnd.com
Oh yeah, there’s more to come on the intrusive front- the Resident wants to know where you are at all times, so he can reach into your pocket and grab mo’ money. With him, it’s all about the Benjamins. But wait- there’s more!
“The proposed GPS road tax system could easily be programmed to listen to and record conversations inside any vehicle. It could stop a vehicle, lock the occupants inside and notify the ‘jack boots’ that the occupants were en route to a tea party,” Lamb wrote. “We would hope that the federal government would never sink to the level of paranoia that gripped Nazi Germany. But then, we also hoped that the federal government would never sink to the level of labeling legal, peaceful assemblies, such as the recent tea parties, as gatherings of potential terrorists.”
wnd.com
These socialists we have in the government now are coming at us from all directions, and wanting control of our lives, because they are sure that they know how to rule us- they are the elites, after all- just ask Bill Maher, who believes that America is a “stupid” country. How enlightening of him to grace us with his wisdom. Here’s a guy who couldn’t survive outside of his studio for more than five minutes, and he looks down on America?
I hope that he is being taxed to the max, because I am telling the hospital that he is paying for my next surgery.
I’m sure he won’t mind- he is such a tolerant sort.
[tip]If you enjoy what you read consider signing up to receive email notification of new posts. There are several options in the sidebar and I am sure you can find one that suits you. If you prefer, consider adding this site to your favorite feed reader. If you receive emails and wish to stop them follow the instructions included in the email.[/tip]
Tags: communists, GPS snooping, invasion of privacy, taxes
I can say this from a very qualified position, as someone who has designed applications for GPS technology, Henry Lamb is a flat out idiot. That’s what you get when reading WND though.
To be clear, I don’t like the H.R. 3311 proposal. I don’t see much benefit to it, besides funding some research projects for graduate college students, which is a good thing. I don’t see how this alternate tax is supposed to accomplish anything that the current gasoline tax doesn’t already accomplish. I doubt this bill makes it very far. To suggest though that, “The proposed GPS road tax system could easily be programmed to listen to and record conversations inside any vehicle. It could stop a vehicle, lock the occupants inside and notify the ‘jack boots’ that the occupants were en route to a tea party,” is simply outrageous and quite stupifying.
The bill BTW, never mentions GPS. It can be read here:
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h111-3311
Not outrageous- just not done now- but with Hussein, one never knows.
While a GPS itself might not be able to be programmed to do these things it would not be difficult to add the components to the device to do it. I am not saying they are going to do so only that it could be done by adding the right equipment. Vehicles can be remote controlled and they could add a device that could be turned on to listen. It is one thing to doubt they would do it and another all together to say that COULD not do it. The technology exists.
As I stated earlier, I oppose it for what we know GPS can be used for. They want this because people are buying more fuel efficient cars so they are using less gas therefore fewer tax dollars are taken in. I don’t believe they will get rid of the gas tax, they will just add this tax to it. Government usually does not get rid of a tax.
One thing is certain, they could track you and find you at any time with the GPS (like they can with cell phones). I have no doubt in my military mind that if they wanted to find you they would use the system that was designed to only track mileage. They would be big brother.
The bill doesn’t mention GPS. I posted a link to the full text above. It would take less than ten minutes to read carefully as all it does is ask for money to be allocated in the form of grants to university research projects to study the feasibility of such an alternative tax on mileage instead of gas consumption. I doubt the bill will make it very far because the program won’t provide enough revenues to be worth implementing on a national scale. Not to mention the logistics of implementing such a project.
As for WND, this Henry Lamb character is either dumb or lying. I lean toward lying with the motivation of scaring people like yourself. Technology does exist to remotely control vehicles, but there is nothing simple about it.
Have you heard of OnStar, Randy? Technology is already there for some, and it could be adapted for others- your “expertise” seems to be in denying things that already exist.
If you cover your eyes, are the monsters still there?
I’m not the one seeing imaginary monsters here Blake, you are. OnStar doesn’t use GPS, so Henry Lamb is still a liar whose lies you swallowed hook, line, and sinker. I have posted a more in depth response below. Please read it.
No, the bill never SPECIFICALLY mentions GPS, although it DOES mention all forms of ON BOARD equipment, of which GPS can and would be included in that description- can we agree on that much, or are you going to be the type of person who says, “Well, they didn’t specifically SAY it, so it isn’t so.”
You know better than that. How else could they track and keep tally of miles traveled? Another odometer- government controlled?
Henry Lamb SPECIFICALLY said GPS.
More right wing paranoid delusions brought to us by the conspiracy morons at WND. You want to know why Maher can call Americans stupid? Because there are people out here in our country who read WND as if it’s a legitimate news source. It’s one thing to be biased but it’s another to just flat out lie through your teeth like WND does so often.
For some reason the same people who say the government can do nothing right somehow always seem to believe that same government has the power to track the 3/4ths of a billion vehicles on the road today so the “jack boots” know to bust them up for opposing the president. Right. Get back to us when this bill comes out of committee.
Actually Maher calls people stupid because of a misplaced and utterly delusional sense of entitlement brought on by the nonsense of the left reinforcing what he believes in. The feeling of superiority is utterly misplaced, but the left lies to itself as easily as it attempts to lie to people who know better. One difference- we know better. You all are just delusional.
Also, its possible that Maher has met you, Adam.
The possibility exists- it is like the WH wanting to snitch out someone- perhaps it is benign, but the potential is there for abuse.
And as far as WND, you all cite leftie sources you say I should take seriously- so what’s up?
AND, if this should come about in its most benign form, it is still an invasion of privacy, plus an ADDITIONAL tax, since they wouldn’t forego the gas tax.
Do you really WANT this bill to come out of committee?
The possibility that the federal government will install GPS devices that will record our conversations and shut down our cars and lock us in our cars at will does not exist. I could write a book about all the reasons such a thing would not be feasible. As I stated, after reading the bill, which you clearly have not, I am not for the proposal for the study. My reasons for being against it have nothing to do with the paranoid rantings of WND though. The bill explicitly says:
To direct the Secretary of the Treasury to establish a pilot program to study alternatives to the current system of taxing motor vehicle fuels, including systems based on the number of miles traveled by each vehicle.
So it’s a proposal to fund a study of the feasibility of coming up with an ALTERNATIVE to the current system of taxing motor vehicle fuels. To FOREGO the current system.
Again, I have previously stated that I don’t like the bill. I would be perfectly happy if it were killed in committee. Look at it this way…I’m trying to help. What Henry Lamb is suggesting using the forum of WND is stupid. It’s really, really stupid. Most folks that regularly work in the fields of technology and most hobbyists will recognize this on it’s face. Repeating this BS takes away from the credibility of anyone willing to pass it along.
I am not as concerned about that as I am about all these convoluted methods being considered for taxes- This is stupid.
We cannot afford Healthcare change right now- we cannot afford Cap and Fraud right now, there is a LOT we cannot afford right now, and these politicians are riding right over our concerns as if we were not there, and people ask why people are shouting in town halls?
The town hall protesters are there to stifle debate, not participate in it. I guess this is my larger point in posting, the opposition you and WND are posting against H.R. 3311 is crap. There is valid opposition to be had against the proposal, but whining about secret recording devices and remote control of your vehicle is untrue and quite stupid. Same with the health care bill. If the protesters voiced civil opposition against real provisions in the bill, they would probably be taken much more seriously in threatening the passage of the bill. This nonsense about death panels and mandatory hospice counseling shouting down the real debate is dishonest. The information age is here, it has been for a while. Spreading disinformation doesn’t go as far as it used to. Notice how I link to the full text of bills often. I always do my best to verify what an article is claiming before I go around linking to it or citing it or repeating claims that are being made within. WND thrives on people that don’t do that.
Randy- the protesters have very real complaints against the Healthcare abortion of a bill- noone in Washington wants to read it, its fractured into three versions, and our Reps lie to us when they say ” no, that is never going to be in the bill,” and then they stick it in at the last minute as they did with more than 300 amendments on the Cap & Lie bill the wouldn’t even read either. One truly begins to wonder about the patriotism of this administration when they pass bills that are so clearly designed to cause harm to this country, as they have for the last six months.
Now, while the technology might not be used, the technology is there and available.
I find it fascinating that Facism is coming at us from the left, but perhaps I shouldn’t be- the left has always been about control through government, while the right has been about freedom for opportunity.
Excuse me while I opt for the right.
Whether or not they could use such a system to record conversations is speculation. What we do know is that they can use the GPS to track where you go. The purpose might be for taxing mileage but if you suddenly become a person of interest in something and they want to find you they will use the GPS. It is not a wise idea.
As for replacing the current system, I do not see that happening. I see them still adding taxes to gasoline AND taxing mileage. The GPS cannot differentiate between private and public roads so those who drive on private roads would be taxed for driving on a road that the government does not maintain.
There are many tings wrong with this approach. I o not need to dwell on the speculative when I can use what we know they can do to formulate an opinion against such an idea.
You cannot say with reliability that such things could not happen- we already have OnStar, which knows where you are, tracks the internal diagnostics of your engine, and can unlock your car. Presumably they could also lock your car, and they have the capability to turn your car off.
So do not try to say that it CAN’T be done, just hope it WON’T be done.
Right, and what technology does OnStar not use? Answer: GPS. Is there anything simple about installing OnStar in an automobile that isn’t designed to receive OnStar hardware? Answer: No. We could more easily duct tape an active cell phone underneath the drivers side seat of every automobile in the country to listen to conversations going on inside. What Henry Lamb is suggesting is not mere conspiracy theory, it’s complete BS.
Believe me- if the gubbmint decides to take your money, they will find a way- and if the OnStar doesn’t have GPS, that’s the only facet they do not have.
I have a handheld GPS that runs on 2 AA batteries, and it puts me right on top of my fishing hole.
Randy, you are a liar if you maintain it would be too hard to do something like this. It’s really not that hard at all.
It might not happen, but if not, the A**holes in Washington will try again to make everything a toll road.
Yes, GPS is amazing technology. It can pinpoint the location of a GPS receiver within a few meters. Though it is not perfect by any means. It CANNOT record conversations and remotely take over features of your car.
“and if the OnStar doesn’t have GPS, that’s the only facet they do not have.” -Blake
What the hell does that even mean?
They can and do relay (with the possibility of recording) conversations- they can lock and unlock your car- they can even stop it in its tracks. Gee- what more could a growing fascist want?
Just as long as you realize that cars are built at the factory to be equipped for an OnStar system, which again, uses no GPS. (Just to remind anyone still reading this thread, Blake reposted a claim by Henry Lamb on WND that GPS systems could easily be programmed to record your conversations and remotely lock and turn off your automobiles)
OnStar has to be wired into the computer in the car, which is specifically designed to support OnStar features. It uses cellular transceiver technology to move larger amounts of data than is possible with GPS signals, which use simplex data transmission BTW. OnStar can do all sorts of things because your whole car is built like a very large PDA, which will be useless to the government if a car is in a cellular dead zone. To equip every car in the US with this technology would be a truly biblical task.
I understand the guy said GPS and OnStar does not use it. That does not mean the technology cannot be combined with a GPS system. I am not saying they are going to do it, only that it could be done. No, GPS alone could not do it but in combination with other devices it could.
Yes, and it would be a pain in the a$$, as well as redundant, to combine the two technologies and mandate that every car in the US have such technology installed. There isn’t anything simple about it. Henry Lamb posted an article that was fear mongering BS. Blake repeated the fear mongering BS here.
When has government ever done anything simple, or cheap?
I posited the possibility that this might come to pass. The fact is that this should not come to pass is,or should be moot. The fact that they could begin to do this is approaching reality- why do you think they want us in newer cars and trucks? possibly for the computer upgrades in these newer cars.
Most of the “clunkers” traded in were perfectly good autos with low emissions, so was it really to “jump- start ” the auto industry? Or to get newer computers, or as you say, PDAs?
What happens when the cash runs out? Are the car companies on their own again?
During FDR the farmers killed livestock and plowed perfectly good crops in order to stimulate. You cannot stimulate by destroying perfectly good items so people buy new or so that prices go up. The cash for clunkers is a new idea of the old theme. People are turning in good cars (not all of them are good) and buying new ones that get marginally better mileage. Now the price of cars is going up because of an increased demand but at what cost? People are now taking on new debt, the issue that helped get them in trouble to begin with.
So which “lefty” sources do I cite that are by equally moronic, delusional and outright liars as the folks from WND? I cite sources that have facts and truth. WND is neither.
Sorry, but the idea that the White House is looking for snitches is just another paranoid delusion spread around garbage sites like WND and propped up by rubes like you, Blake.
This is from your perspective, Adam- as I have said before- it seems as if no matter WHAT sources I give you- LA Times, NY Times- it doesn’t seem to matter with you, you reject them, then cite HufPO, or Kos or some other whackjob site.
You are just unduly argumentative.
I don’t recall ever posting Kos as a source so I think you made that up. I hardly ever read Kos, let alone cite them.
I also don’t recall ever questioning a source you cited from a legitimate place like the LA Times or the NY Times. But I admit I can’t recall you citing many sources at all, let alone a real one. Too bad you didn’t cite one of them here instead of that rubbish from WND. Then maybe your argument might have had some kind of weight behind it.
If you think I’m unduly argumentative then excuse me. I guess I should just shut up and let your fact free, logic free blog postings go unquestioned. It would be a wonderful world indeed where you could post outrageous and utterly wrong opinions on the web and not have some unduly argumentative fellow like myself mock you for it.
There should be a discourse, but in your own words, you “mock” me for my opinion- way to go there-Argumentative I can handle, and while you have no respect for WND, I have cited other sources in the past that, because of “inconvenient facts”, you scoff at.
You have never just accepted a source I have put forth, no matter who it was, so I have to come to the conclusion that you are a sock puppet for Hussein the Big Eared.
You will never agree with me,no matter what say.
Don’t mistake your inability to convince me with your lack of logic and facts as me being too stubborn or argumentative. Big Dog and I hardly ever agree but we do once in a while and I change my opinions all the time. It’s you, not me.
I mock you because you say things so stupid all the time. Let me paraphrase one of my favorites that made me think so little of you that I stopped reading the site for several weeks:
“Turtles aren’t smart enough to know to take a tunnel so this turtle tunnel is a bad idea and a waste of money.” When I pointed out that the project is based on a highly successful already fully established project in another location that forces wildlife to cross through the tunnel because barriers block all other ways and in no way requires the animals to be intelligent, what did you do? Nothing. You didn’t change your opinion, you didn’t admit a mistake, you just kept on arguing your original point.
It is you, not me, that has a problem accepting sources and facts. I’m either going to quit reading the site or I’m going to keep mocking you for what you write. Accepting your rubbish as fact and changing my opinion? That’s really not an option when it comes to you.
No, you refused to listen to the real argument which was that regardless if the turtles have the intelligence of Hussein or not, WE CANNOT AFFORD THIS TRIVIALITY RIGHT NOW, or can you not read?
If we had the money, i would have no objection to this, but we have people suffering, and we should put turtles first?
Where are your priorities?
Maybe you should read what you wrote to refresh your memory.
Your “real argument” comes in the very last sentence apparently after 6 paragraphs and a blockquote about how you would have more support for spending the money on this project if it actually worked but it won’t because those gosh darn turtles are gonna just cross wherever they feel like.
Once it was clear the project has and would work again you moved the goal posts to say oh my “real argument” was that we can’t afford to spend it at all, regardless if it will work, you can’t read…blah blah.
I can’t imagine why I feel the need to mock that. It’s so mean of me…
I’m going to refuse to rehash this old argument- it wastes space that we cold better use, but feel free to rant on- it only makes you look like an idiot.
Adam, you simply do not know how to carry on a civil conversation, so you fit in with Obama and the dems very well.