Border Patrol Beats Baptist Pastor
by Big Dog on Apr 18, 2009 at 22:23 Political
A Baptist Pastor was on his way home when he stopped at a border patrol checkpoint. They asked him a bunch of questions which he said he would not like to answer. Then they told him they wanted to search his car and he told them no. They brought a dog out walked it by the car and took it away. They told him the dog alerted on drugs or humans and they now had probable cause to search. The 8 minutes of this video is well worth watching.
There were two border patrol agents who were sent to jail for shooting a fleeing drug smuggler. They were doing their jobs and ended up in jail.
Anyone want to bet that these Border Patrol Agents, the ones who actually belong in jail, are not even counseled on their behavior? These guys will not get a second look.
Until the lawsuit. I hope this pastor gets so much money in the lawsuit that it makes the “stimulus” look like child’s play.
Is this what we are coming to with The Won running the country?
Is this the training ground for the jackbooted brown shirts?
The irony is that the Border Patrol Agents will not do anything to the ILLEGALS coming in. Instead they harass American citizens and assault them.
Keep in mind that this is his account of the story. He could have gotten beaten up in a gay bar and wants to hide that. If he was arrested there will be a record of it. I read somewhere he was arrested before for refusing to give information (his right) and refusing to allow a search of his car (again, his right). If he was beaten by the BP then they need to be fired.
For now, I am siding with him until someone can show this is not for real.
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Tags: assault, border patrol agents, crime, Obama, police state
Dog, I’m sure not sure, but something doesn’t ‘feel’ right. Maybe it was the too dramatization of it, but something doesn’t fit. I cannot put my figure on it because it’s a gut response, but maybe he was a little more sassay(?) or in-your-face with the BP? I don’t know. Keep us updated, okay? Thanks.
Yes Rosemary, this is but one man’s account- it would be helpful to see the other videos. I imagine that we will, in the future.
However, if true, it would be troubling. You do need to keep in mind that not all police are helpful, and Border Patrol in particular might no be as trained up as some others. We will have to see what the other evidence shows.
I went to the church website, where he is listed as the pastor. I obtained his email from there and sent a message to inquire how the court proceedings went. The email came back undeliverable.
“There were two border patrol agents who were sent to jail for shooting a fleeing drug smuggler. They were doing their jobs and ended up in jail.”
Let’s not forget the part that wasn’t in the job description: covering up the incident with false reports and lies. I’m glad they are out of jail but I still don’t like when folks imply they did nothing to deserve jail time and were only doing their job.
Adam, I can’t say that they intentionally “covered up” that incident- they shot at a fleeing drug suspect, who kept fleeing even after being shot in the butt- I am not sure if they knew he had been shot. They cleaned up their spent brass, because that’s what they are taught to do. You would know this if you had ever fired a pistol at a gun range.
And if, in their minds, there was no shooting, why spend the time filing a report on something that may, in their minds, have been a non event? Paperwork is something no one likes.
You don’t always know if you hit what you shot at, particularly if you hit it in a non- lethal area.
Now I am not saying there were no mistakes. Personally, I wish they had shot the druggie lethally- there would have been less blowback regarding the dirtbag’s “rights”.
Plus, the dirtbag wouldn’t have been still shuttling in drugs while under immunity by the prosecutor.
It seems so trendy to give non- citizens all kinds of rights, while taking these same rights from people who were born here. This is a trend that has to stop.
Illegals have no rights except the right to go home to their own land. To have rights, you need to be a citizen, and the way to do that is lawfully apply in the correct fashion.
Your re-framing of the event doesn’t really match up with the evidence presented. As this DOJ statement says:
As I said before I’m glad they’re out and can get on with their lives with their families but let’s not keep pretending they did nothing wrong. Calling Aldrete a dirtbag and saying you wish they’d have shot him and killed him doesn’t add anything really.
I’m afraid I will have to stand by my “dirtbag” comment, Adam- a suspect that continues a pattern of unlawful behavior, not once, but twice after he was granted immunity is exactly that- its just like some libs to want to soft- pedal the descriptions of everything.
Ssshhh- lets not call it a “problem”, its an “issue”- The child is not a “brat” he is “challenged”. What a crock.
No, Adam,it is we who are challenged by misdirection when people don’t call a spade a spade.
These Border Patrol Agents shot at a suspect that was attempting to flee back over the river- he began to turn in their direction, and they shot- now, once again, you might argue their actions as justified or not, but I side with them, rather than the drug smuggler.
They did nothing to deserve jail time. Whatever they did (and we only know what was alleged) could have been handled with personnel actions like suspensions or fines.
Evading taxes can get you in jail but how many of Obama’s team are in jail for that?
Point is, jail was harsh for the alleged wrong doings. I understand they did not file the paperwork and were hinky on the time line. Either way, they did not belong in jail.
What they did to the drug smuggler is a separate issue from what they did administratively. Bringing the drug smuggler here to testify and then granting immunity and paying his medical bills made this even worse.
I do not condone their missteps in handling the administrative part but they were only doing their jobs when they shot him. Jail was way overboard in this case.
Clinton covered up an incident with lies (to a grand jury) and he did not go to jail.
[…] have to disagree with Big Dog on this […]
Thanks for the pingback. I so not disagree with your assessment. That is why I put this caveat at the bottom:
Keep in mind that this is his account of the story. He could have gotten beaten up in a gay bar and wants to hide that. If he was arrested there will be a record of it. I read somewhere he was arrested before for refusing to give information (his right) and refusing to allow a search of his car (again, his right). If he was beaten by the BP then they need to be fired.
Regardless, he should not have been beaten like that UNLESS he started fighting. They did not have to taze him (bro) and grind his face in the glass.
I would like to see the video of the incident and not just the border patrol agen account.
The whole thing is weird.
I am against police state tactics by law enforcement, but why the insistence on refusing to co-operate with the fuzz?
If this incident did happen, he should have legal action underway.
If he does take legal action, and the agents are found ‘guilty’, won’t it make it much harder for them when some coyote with a trunk full of felons pulls the same routine as this pastor?
Personally, I say cooperate with law enforcement, take names and pics if you think your rights are being violated, and the behavior to the agents’ supervisors.
Cops have a hard enough time, they shouldn’t get a hassle from law abiding citizens too.
PS please do update us if there’s more to this story.
I understand completely the issues involved. From what he says, he did not allow a search of his vehicle and then they brought a dog that displayed no behavior to indicate it found something. This, if true, is a way of manufacturing probable cause.
They do it a lot to stop you when they say you crossed a line and then claim to smell alcohol. This gives them probable cause.
I have worked with many cops who said never let probable cause get in the way, you can always invent it.
Even if this guy was wrong did he deserve to be brutalized? Rodney King got a beating and won a lawsuit due to excessive force. Unless this guy was fighting (which is hard to believe if he was tazed) then he was in custody and under control when they pulled him out. Was it necessary to keep tazing (his claim) him and to step on his head.
He did not get that cut without some kind of force.
It will all play out but even if he was a jerk and had done this before does he lose his right not to be beaten up by police?
Also, why does the border patrol have checkpoints WITHIN our country? Shouldn’t they have their checkpoints at the border?
I also imagine that if he were black this would have a lot of attention regardless of the past. Sharpton, Jackson, NAACP, ACLU and all the usual suspects would be protesting in the streets.
The beauty of being a white man in America is that we are rarely in need of an advocacy group to leap to our defense when something has gone wrong so it’s not much of a comparison to bring up Sharpton and Jackson.
that is just your opinion, not based on any statistics
So you want to present some data to show that white men need an advocacy group to stand up for them?
Is there an unspoken of vein of race and gender based harassment of white men in America that I don’t know about having been a white man in America all my life?
Well Big Dog, I am disappointed in you. Why would he not comply with any of the border agents requests? I think this is one more person for open borders taking advantage of the system. and the agents If his description of the event is accurate, he really doesn’t have much to show for it. I have gone through those checkpoints by car and had not problem with complying with requets, even coming back from Mexico by plane, I have had my luggage gone through, I haven’t liked it but I understand why. If city police had that problem, do you think they would have said to him, Oh, okay, just drive on then, and walked away. As a former Southern California resident, I applaud the border patrol, they have a very difficult job, made more difficult by citizens who want open borders. For those people, please go to downtown LA and walk around, if you are brave enough. Check out how much illegals drain the resources of the state of California and then you will understand why California is bankrupt, they don’t pay taxes, and the money is sent back to Mexico, which helps the economy of a very corrupt govenment, and Obuma once again apologizes for this country and blames us for their problems, which they have allowed to go on for years and years.
Adam, your statistics are based on your own personal experience and another question. You are a true liberal. Not just black, hispanic, are in the court system fighting injustices, open up your eyes. Are you a paid liberal blogger just to stir up controversy?
Yes, I’m paid just to argue with Big Dog all day. It hurts to laugh. 😉
I want my cut. And make sure you pay your taxes unless you are looking for a job with Obama.
You do a good job- kudos to your argumentativeness.
Carla,
The man was driving IN the US. He was not crossing a border. What gives them the right to stop him and check him? He has a Fourth Amendment right against such things. He broke no law and the BP had no right to stop him INSIDE the country. He was not crossing the border, in which case I would agree.
Adam,
The faux racism in America screed is tiresome. Black men need no advocacy group. They have it just as good as anyone else. Only people’s ideas of perceived racism is what perpetuates these things.
But I am curious, if he were black do you think there should be outrage? Obviously being white did not help this guy.
Everything you guys see is racist. Sorry, does not wash. There is institutional discrimination against whites all the time. We call it affirmative action but it is racist nonetheless.
Adam,
Those are statements from the DOJ questioning the event. However, if he was a fleeing felon then he did not need to pose no threat. There is also no indication as to whether they thought they hit him. They did not follow him because he went back into Mexico.
Shoot to kill. Then there is only one story that needs to be heard.
While this story needs to go through the courts, I am with Dog on this faux racism- I have NEVER seen Sharpton, Jackson, Farrakhan, or any of the other Black, Hispanic, or other groups EVER help a white guy, whether rich or poor.
Their agenda is to promote racism, because if racism goes away, they have to find a real job, rather than stir the pot.
I am especially offended by this statement
“Until the lawsuit. I hope this pastor gets so much money in the lawsuit that it makes the “stimulus” look like child’s play.” I hope it only comes out of your pocket, and Adams.
Carla, if his rights were violated he deserves to be compensated. Of course the reference to the stimulus was an exaggeration but if he was wronged I hope he gets adequately compensated.
If he instigated it then I hope he is found guilty.
The government paid something like 5 million dollars to the drug smuggler who was shot and paid all of his medical bills. The pastor is an American citizen and should not have been treated this way.
No matter what he did there was no reason to brutalize him. He was under control the moment they tazed him. To beat him up after that was excessive force.
You don’t have to agree with his stance or his position on things but he has rights like everyone else.
I’ve been reading this Pastor’s wife’s blog. She acts like her husband being beaten by law enforcement means this country is becoming totalitarian.
I think this guy needs to have his say in court and probably deserves compensation. But he’s not the first person to be subject to police brutality so I really wish they’d just get over themselves in that regard and stop acting like this is the first shot fired in a war between the American people and a gestapo like army or some BS like that.
He is not the first to be attacked by law enforcement and he will not be the last. However, her protestations are no more dramatic than those made on behalf of Rodney King.
Wait, as I recall there were riots when the cops were found not guilty. So the King thing was way more dramatic.
First of all Rodney King was actually beaten by the police. The pastor was just tased and thrown on the ground causing facial lacerations. That’s bad of course but not as bad as getting facial fractures and a broken leg on top of the tasing and the lacerations.
Second, I don’t mind them being upset about the treatment of the pastor and I probably should speak ill of those involved but to act like this signals a shift to totalitarianism is just idiotic.
He was thrown to the ground and his head stepped upon and ground into the broken glass.
King was still resisting when he was beaten. Not saying he deserved the beating he got because I was not there. However, the riots were uncalled for and people who had nothing to do with the beating or the verdict were seriously injured.
Except for the Koreans. They had guns…
Adam, besides the color of his skin, how was this situation, if true, different from that of Rodney King, or any other alleged police brutality. You say because he was not hurt as severely, that this incident doesn’t compare?
I grew up in the sixties, when there was some real brutality, so don’t try to impress me with stats. I lived this period.
The point is that here was an American who was allegedly beaten with very little cause by police (border patrol) who may have had a bogus reason to do so. The courts will determine this, but IF TRUE, this was egregious in the extreme, and the fact that he was white should not have any bearing on this.
I don’t believe that this signals a shift to totalitarianism, but as I think we can all agree on, not everyone is cut out to be a law enforcement officer- some are just too Type A, and allow themselves to lose control.